Kanadischer DX160-Besitzer auf der Suche nach Informationen

[evranch_canada]

Hallo alle,
Ich bin ein kanadischer Bauer und langjähriger Deutz-Besitzer. Ich habe DX160- und D5505-Traktoren und mehrere GP2.50-Ballenpressen. Da ich kein Deutsch spreche, muss ich dies durch einen Übersetzer übertragen. Ich hoffe, es ist nicht zu schlecht zum Lesen.

Deutz ist ein großartiger Traktor und sehr robust, aber es ist sehr schwierig, hier Informationen zu finden. Sogar Händler haben keine Bücher und online verkaufte Handbücher sind oft falsch. Alle Arbeiten müssen durch die Intuition eines Mechanikers selbst erledigt werden, aber schließlich habe ich dieses Forum mit so vielen guten Informationen gefunden!

Ich würde mich über jede Information über den DX160 freuen, da dieses Modell offenbar in Europa nicht sehr beliebt war. Früher war es hier üblich, aber viele scheiterten an der falschen veröffentlichten Getriebeölspezifikation und wurden verschrottet.

Meines ist immer noch im aktiven Einsatz, die Leute fragen, warum die Übertragung funktioniert. Meine Antwort lautet: Ich habe es mit vielen Betriebsstunden gekauft und war nie mutig genug, das Getriebeöl zu wechseln!

Es muss das richtige Gewicht haben, ist aber sehr alt und schwarz. Ich würde es gerne ändern, aber jeder sagt, ich soll etwas anderes verwenden. Mehrere Leute haben 15W40 gesagt, aber hier handelt es sich um Motoröl, niemals um Getriebeöl.

Daher würde ich mich über alle Informationen freuen, die Sie mir über DX160 mitteilen können. Ich kann diese hier nicht einmal kaufen.

- Bedienungsanleitung
- Werkstatt-Handbuch
- Teilehandbuch

Ich habe an meinem DX160 mehrere Projekte geplant, vor allem das Getriebe, hoffentlich den Wechsel der Zapfwelle zur Dual-Speed-Einheit und die Überprüfung lockerer Arretierungen und Stockfedern, wenn das Getriebeöl abgelassen ist, aber das reicht wahrscheinlich für einen ersten Beitrag.

Ich hoffe, dass ich hier teilnehmen kann, auch wenn ich übersetzen muss. Allein durch das Lesen gibt es hier so viel Deutz-Wissen im Vergleich zu irgendwo sonst auf Englisch. Ich wünschte, ich hätte das schon vor langer Zeit gefunden!

 

[Karel Vermoesen]

Hi,
Under the topic "Duo Zapfwelle DX7.10" you can find information regarding the dual-speed PTO for the DX140/160.
regards,
Karel Vermoesen

 

[Deutz45nullfuenf]

Hello, you can write in english. The technical topics are often better to understand when you write it in your own words.

 

[swd40]

Hi,

btw, writing in english is fine. Yes, the vast majority of the postings are german but it's easier to have the technical terms correct and not obfuscated by a translator. I.e. 'Übertragung' was translated maybe from gearbox or transmission, which would be 'Getriebe' in german.

Regards,

Josef

 

[Karel Vermoesen]

Hi,
Canadian co-operative implements limited was importer till 1985, for Deutz in Canada. They have a group on facebook. Maybe they can help.
regards,
Karel Vermoesen

 

[evranch_canada]

Thanks, I never thought I could write in English as everything including the forum interface is German! That is much easier for everyone. Reading through the history of posts I have automatic translate turned on in my browser, and yes it can be hard to understand what technical terms are being referred to.

So my DX160 has "Co-op Implements" badging. Unfortunately Co-op Implements were the ones responsible for specifying incorrect transmission oil, which is why very few DX160 survive to this day.

The DX series ruined Deutz reputation here as many blew transmissions and differentials in the field and had to be farmed around. That is why I'm looking for information directly from the source before I change that oil. English Deutz DX information in Canada/USA is either sold in little fragments at high prices or not available. There must be real original German manuals out there somewhere?

For the same reason Co-op Implements basically disappeared after the DX series issues. I don't participate in Facebook, I find information on there tends to be poor, but maybe the group is worth a look.

Thanks for the dual PTO information, I bought a cheap DX160 for parts which has the DX7.10 dual PTO mounted and am hoping to swap it onto my good DX160. Mine has the long nose 1000 PTO but I use it to run 540 balers with a portable gearbox. This is a bad solution that results in a short driveline and misalignment.

By the way the only reason the parts tractor is "parts" is that it is stuck in Z range. The motor runs strong and it also has a working transmission, but a tractor that cannot back up is not much use. 1-4 work smoothly so I suspect something simple is wrong with the range stick or the shift fork/detent because the range stick barely moves. This is a long term project though, as the tires and PTO will be swapped to my working DX160.

 

[Oberwesterwälder]

Hello,

about the transmission oil:

Engine oil is to be used in this transmission

Ölspezifikationen und Ölviskositäten und Ölmengen für die DX 3 und DX 4 und DX 6 und DX 7 Traktoren.


Regards
Martin

Edit:
@Karel Vermoesen has the better information about the oil.
So forget what i have been writing before.

 

[Karel Vermoesen]

Hi,
Attention! Of the DX160 there are two versions of drivetrain, Steyr TW1200 and TW1300 depending on the serial number.
Serial number 7624/.... single wheel drive with TW1200
Serial number 7625/.... four-wheel drive with TW1200
Series number 7824/.... Single wheel drive with TW1300
Series number 7825/.... Four wheel drive with TW1300
Series number 7442/.... Single wheel drive with TW1300
Series number 7443/.... four wheel drive with TW1300
The DX7.10 has the Steyr TW1310 drivetrain with numerous improvements.
It is precisely the use of engine oil 15W40 in the drivetrain that causes the problems. A gear oil is needed for the gearbox, but one that does not eat away the bronze. (Castrol Syntrax 75W90)
regards,
Karel Vermoesen

 

[100er]

Hi,

You don't have to spend hefty amounts of money on literature. The SDF Group has its own website where you can search for old manuals, adverts and even the real workshop manuals for axles, transmissions etc.
Each "book" usually costs about 15€ for the digital version. In my opinion the payment procedure is a bit strange, but it works, I've bought some stuff for myself a while ago.

Take a look at the search results for "DX 160".

Regards,
Philipp

 

[evranch_canada]

Thanks very much! I will check the serial number and use it to identify the transmission. Hopefully both tractors have the same transmission and the PTO will swap with no issues. They are both rear wheel drive, 4WD was not common here.

That's good to know that engine oil is what damages the transmission. Most of my older equipment is running Mobil SHC 629 in gearboxes and transmissions as I have an "unlimited" supply of this synthetic gear oil. We change it out every year from the gearboxes at the local generating station for warranty purposes, but it is very clean and in good condition. This ISO 150 gear oil is equivalent to SAE 90 gear oil but does not contain EP additives.

I had considered using it in the DX160 as well but was obviously hesitant due to the transmission's reputation. Does it sound like it would be a good choice, it should be fairly similar to the Syntrax.


That SDF website looks like a great resource! However am I missing something as to why only the operating manual appears to be available for purchase? Is there a way to request the technical and workshop manuals, or perhaps they haven't been scanned?

 

[100er]

You're right, it looks like the workshop manuals have not all been digitized yet.

Maybe you can send them a request to:
**********

 

[evranch_canada]

I checked the serial numbers of my tractor and my parts tractor and I can't believe it! They are brothers!

7624/0084 and 7624/0085

Mine was purchased by the previous owner of my farm, and the parts tractor came from about 100km away. Interesting that both successive serial numbers survived in a usable state when so many others were damaged.

Is there significance to having the TW1200 rather than the TW1300 transmission in terms of care and operation, or does it only affect parts availability?

 

[evranch_canada]

To confirm the gear oil recommendation of Karel, I tried to look up the transmission and found this document for the testing of a Steyr 397.25 tractor with TW1200 transmission.

In the specifications it states the TW1200 has a common oil case for gearbox, axle, final drives and hydraulic circuits that requires "80L multi-purpose oil" (the big problem!).

Recommended oil: Tractor-universal oil SAE15W-30 or SAE20W-30, MIL-L-2104C, API CD, SE

This explains why I was told that most of these tractors were filled with what we call in Canada "THF" trans/hydraulic fluid, which is the "tractor-universal oil" for American made tractors. This product is usually very light, SAE 10 to 30 weight, and likely resulted in the differential failures.

However API CD is the specification for diesel engine oil, and you are saying the additives in diesel engine oil will damage yellow metals? Did older diesel oils contain a different additive package that was safe?

SAE 20W-30 engine oil does cross to SAE 75W-90 gear oil, though, so it sounds like the 75W-90 would be a good choice. It also sounds like the synthetic ISO 150 gear oil I have available would be sufficient since there is no requirement for EP additives. It is a bit heavier at straight SAE 90 weight, but usually in tractor transmissions I have found heavier is safer due to low speeds and high torque.

 

[Karel Vermoesen]

Hi,
We had several DX160 and DX7.10 in use by contracting companies.(foto) Of the DX7.10, most reached over 20,000 hours. Knowledge and parts of the Steyr TW1200,1300 and 1310 drivetrain can be obtained from Kammerhuber Schiedlberg Austria.
All DX7.10 tractors ran with us on Castrol Syntrax 75W90 synthetic oil. This oil was known to contain no additives that would damage the bronze parts. This is to be verified when using any other oil.
Regards,
Karel Vermoesen

 

[DX Ontario]

Hi there,
it sounds like you are from western Canada so my little bit of info might not help you that much.

I am from Ontario and enjoy the DX and older Deutz tractors.

Minto Ag is a Great Deutz dealer here in Harriston, Ontario and we also have several salvage shops that have a decent amount of Dx salvage tractors and parts here.
Quite a few Dx where sold here in the 80‘s.
Best regards Achim

 

[evranch_canada]

Karel: We had several...
And posts a picture of likely more DX160/7.10 tractors than currently exist in Western Canada!

I will contact Mobil about the additive package in SHC629, if only because we are very rural here and try to keep our stock levels as simple as possible. Otherwise I would definitely go with the Syntrax right away as your experience clearly proves that it is the appropriate oil! I didn't mean to debate your recommendation, more so I wanted to make sure I got to the bottom of the truth behind the damaged transmissions here in Canada.

Thanks Achim for the tip on Minto Ag, I'll likely contact them as many of our local distributors only kind of fell into Deutz by coincidence and don't really specialize in them. Especially for small parts, I'm looking for some detent springs for the D5505 gearbox and those would be perfect to ship.